----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
What does the group think about Pioneer dropping their Plasma Manufacturing?
They make the best plasma display that money can buy but is apparently not
enough.
They are going to use other manufactures system to supply them with panels.
How will they be different other than using their own electronics?
Larry
-----Original Message-----
From: HDTV Magazine Tips List On
Behalf Of Rodolfo La Maestra
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 1:36 PM
To: HDTV Magazine Tips List
Subject: Re: Blu Ray encoding...
----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
Shane has good memory.
Doug,
Questions for narrowing down the problem: Which camera?, which horizontal
resolution? (1440 or 1920), which video processing steps between camera and
display? which projector/scaler (and frame rate acceptance)? which Blu
player? Which video codec? Have you tried using other video codec?
Responding your question, all content sourced from "film" is transferred as
1080p at 24fps on the blu-ray disc. You can create the same film effect
with a video camera that has that frame rate, rather than operate it as 60i.
In the case Shane mentions I did not have any problems with the movies I
played until one day Shane and Dale sat on my HT a year ago when they came
to Washington for CEA; we viewed Casino Royale that just came out on
Blu-ray, the content was recorded in a video codec that was producing
playback problems at 24fps, a feature of that Blu-ray player (and only on
the Blu-ray format at that time).
My Sony Blu-ray player is the original top of the line I purchased on Nov 06
when it just came out. It has the ability to output 24fps content as direct
or as 3:2 pulldown (to get to 60i and p).
To fix that problem of that video codec I later found out that it required a
software upgrade. Sony did not know about, and took a while for them to
understand what I was describing because almost no one was capable to 24fps
playback (at higher frame rates of course); but they fixed it later.
The projection at 1080p 48fps of the 24fps source was dropping frames from
time to time making the image jumpy at intervals, which once you start
noticing is very disturbing, and I believe this might be what you are
experiencing. You have to check the owner's threads in Forums about your
player to determine if that problem was identified already, and to take note
of the fix, maybe is already available.
Now my Sony is at its 3.5 current release (about 5 upgrades) and it plays
very clean, but it was frustrating to me because I specifically built the
system for CinemaScope and 1080p film at 24fps. Toshiba did not even care
about 1080p, not to mention 24fps, so I was not switching to the competitive
format when those features were ignored by the format creator; so I had no
choice than to wait, or to switch to Pioneer Elite at about $1500 at that
time (I paid $1000 for my Sony).
I am glad that I waited.
When you choose the recording frame rate you should consider your target
audience, their need or preference (or not) of film look, and their playback
equipment capability, before you make your original as 24fps 1080p, or 1080i
60.
For most people 24fps playback would force their equipment to do 3:2
pulldown to get to 60i and then deinterlace to 60p, but your audience might
be different.
If your video content is informal, regular viewers might not notice the
heavy video processing of the conversions, but if the content is very
detailed with small objects on the image, and complex, with many camera
pans, you might be better off by staying away from interlace recording and
minimize playback conversions for quality viewing, and perhaps offering also
a separate 60i edited version you encoded at your editing lab from the 24fps
original to make sure you control the quality of the conversion with
professional equipment, not by the TV of the viewer.
However, 60i is actually as roomy as 30fps in content storage, and space
might be an issue to consider for that version of disc (the 6 extra frames
stored as 12 interlaced fields on the 3:2 pulldown processing would take
about 25% more space over the 24fps progressive version). You might need
the space for extra features and hi-bit audio, such as 24+ Mbps DTS MA
edited at very high bit rate at 7.1, if audio quality is important for your
content, and you might need also to add a 5.1 DD track for legacy support of
DD receivers over optical or digital coax connections.
If I would be you, I would try first with a 24fps original and maintain the
signal as progressive on the chain as much as possible, playback equipment
that converts 24fps discs to 60i/p outputs improve every day and video
processing gets refined every day with more processing power and more bits
for linearity.
I hope this helps, this sounds like an interesting project.
Best Regards,
Rodolfo La Maestra
-----Original Message-----
From: HDTV Magazine Tips List On
Behalf Of Shane Sturgeon
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 2:50 PM
To: HDTV Magazine Tips List
Subject: Re: Blu Ray encoding...
----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
Make sure your PS3 is up to date with the latest firmware. Early
revisions of the PS3 firmware had dropped-frame issues. Dale, Rodolfo
and I witnessed this first-hand last year with Casino Royal. Rodolfo may
be able to provide more insight here, as I believe he was following up
on it with Sony.
Shane Sturgeon
Doug Johnson wrote:
> ----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
>
> Our company is making the jump to encoding our HD work on blu ray.
>
> Does anyone here have experience doing this?
>
> Specifically... We shoot almost exclusively in 1080p 23.976. My first
tests
> don't look so hot. There's a funny sort of frame rate issue. Not quite a
3:2
> stutter, more like the PS3 (my test unit) is dropping frames.
>
> Should my video be going to BD as 23.976? Or should I be adding a 3:2 and
> moving to 1080i 29.97?
>
> How are most movies being put to Blu Ray? 23.976? 29.97?
>
> Thanks in advance
> Doug
>
>
> To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
>
> To receive the digest mode (one email a day made from all posted that same
day) send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
To receive the digest mode (one email a day made from all posted that same
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To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
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What does the group think about Pioneer dropping their Plasma Manufacturing?
They make the best plasma display that money can buy but is apparently not
enough.
They are going to use other manufactures system to supply them with panels.
How will they be different other than using their own electronics?
Larry
-----Original Message-----
From: HDTV Magazine Tips List On
Behalf Of Rodolfo La Maestra
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 1:36 PM
To: HDTV Magazine Tips List
Subject: Re: Blu Ray encoding...
----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
Shane has good memory.
Doug,
Questions for narrowing down the problem: Which camera?, which horizontal
resolution? (1440 or 1920), which video processing steps between camera and
display? which projector/scaler (and frame rate acceptance)? which Blu
player? Which video codec? Have you tried using other video codec?
Responding your question, all content sourced from "film" is transferred as
1080p at 24fps on the blu-ray disc. You can create the same film effect
with a video camera that has that frame rate, rather than operate it as 60i.
In the case Shane mentions I did not have any problems with the movies I
played until one day Shane and Dale sat on my HT a year ago when they came
to Washington for CEA; we viewed Casino Royale that just came out on
Blu-ray, the content was recorded in a video codec that was producing
playback problems at 24fps, a feature of that Blu-ray player (and only on
the Blu-ray format at that time).
My Sony Blu-ray player is the original top of the line I purchased on Nov 06
when it just came out. It has the ability to output 24fps content as direct
or as 3:2 pulldown (to get to 60i and p).
To fix that problem of that video codec I later found out that it required a
software upgrade. Sony did not know about, and took a while for them to
understand what I was describing because almost no one was capable to 24fps
playback (at higher frame rates of course); but they fixed it later.
The projection at 1080p 48fps of the 24fps source was dropping frames from
time to time making the image jumpy at intervals, which once you start
noticing is very disturbing, and I believe this might be what you are
experiencing. You have to check the owner's threads in Forums about your
player to determine if that problem was identified already, and to take note
of the fix, maybe is already available.
Now my Sony is at its 3.5 current release (about 5 upgrades) and it plays
very clean, but it was frustrating to me because I specifically built the
system for CinemaScope and 1080p film at 24fps. Toshiba did not even care
about 1080p, not to mention 24fps, so I was not switching to the competitive
format when those features were ignored by the format creator; so I had no
choice than to wait, or to switch to Pioneer Elite at about $1500 at that
time (I paid $1000 for my Sony).
I am glad that I waited.
When you choose the recording frame rate you should consider your target
audience, their need or preference (or not) of film look, and their playback
equipment capability, before you make your original as 24fps 1080p, or 1080i
60.
For most people 24fps playback would force their equipment to do 3:2
pulldown to get to 60i and then deinterlace to 60p, but your audience might
be different.
If your video content is informal, regular viewers might not notice the
heavy video processing of the conversions, but if the content is very
detailed with small objects on the image, and complex, with many camera
pans, you might be better off by staying away from interlace recording and
minimize playback conversions for quality viewing, and perhaps offering also
a separate 60i edited version you encoded at your editing lab from the 24fps
original to make sure you control the quality of the conversion with
professional equipment, not by the TV of the viewer.
However, 60i is actually as roomy as 30fps in content storage, and space
might be an issue to consider for that version of disc (the 6 extra frames
stored as 12 interlaced fields on the 3:2 pulldown processing would take
about 25% more space over the 24fps progressive version). You might need
the space for extra features and hi-bit audio, such as 24+ Mbps DTS MA
edited at very high bit rate at 7.1, if audio quality is important for your
content, and you might need also to add a 5.1 DD track for legacy support of
DD receivers over optical or digital coax connections.
If I would be you, I would try first with a 24fps original and maintain the
signal as progressive on the chain as much as possible, playback equipment
that converts 24fps discs to 60i/p outputs improve every day and video
processing gets refined every day with more processing power and more bits
for linearity.
I hope this helps, this sounds like an interesting project.
Best Regards,
Rodolfo La Maestra
-----Original Message-----
From: HDTV Magazine Tips List On
Behalf Of Shane Sturgeon
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 2:50 PM
To: HDTV Magazine Tips List
Subject: Re: Blu Ray encoding...
----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
Make sure your PS3 is up to date with the latest firmware. Early
revisions of the PS3 firmware had dropped-frame issues. Dale, Rodolfo
and I witnessed this first-hand last year with Casino Royal. Rodolfo may
be able to provide more insight here, as I believe he was following up
on it with Sony.
Shane Sturgeon
Doug Johnson wrote:
> ----- HDTV Magazine Tips List -----
>
> Our company is making the jump to encoding our HD work on blu ray.
>
> Does anyone here have experience doing this?
>
> Specifically... We shoot almost exclusively in 1080p 23.976. My first
tests
> don't look so hot. There's a funny sort of frame rate issue. Not quite a
3:2
> stutter, more like the PS3 (my test unit) is dropping frames.
>
> Should my video be going to BD as 23.976? Or should I be adding a 3:2 and
> moving to 1080i 29.97?
>
> How are most movies being put to Blu Ray? 23.976? 29.97?
>
> Thanks in advance
> Doug
>
>
> To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
>
> To receive the digest mode (one email a day made from all posted that same
day) send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
To receive the digest mode (one email a day made from all posted that same
day) send an email to:
[email protected]
To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
To receive the digest mode (one email a day made from all posted that same
day) send an email to:
[email protected]
To unsubscribe please click: [email protected]
To receive the digest mode (one email a day made from all posted that same day) send an email to:
[email protected]
