2 Years ago I had a RPTV calibrated for $250.00 and to tell you the honest truth, I felt ripped off. After the tech left I set it according to my liking. So in essense, I threw away $250.00...I was under the impression that calibration was some highly skilled deal where the tech was going to go inside the tv and mess with a bunch of intricate settings inside the tv...If I had known that calibration was just a big word for setting your brightness, contrast, color, tint, and the like I would have saved my money and done that myself...(oh well, lesson learned)
What is a real ISF calibration?
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Chukken,
It appears you have never had a TV of yours professionally calibrated. If all the individual did to your TV (when you paid the $250.00) was to adjust the user controls, you were way over-charged! Did he not use a color analyzer or optical comparator to make adjustments in the set's service menu? You make it sound like he only used a test DVD and adjusted the consumer-level controls. That's not a professional gray scale calibration and not a legitimate representation of what the ISF teaches or stands for. It does not sound like you have ever had the opportunity to see what a reference video image can look like.
Concerning subjective picture preferences: you may think a great painting would look better with more pink in it. The artist would likely disagree. The Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers has labored long and hard to establish and promote standards and practices in the professional production community. They have done this to preserve accuracy and consistency all along the production chain. The goal is to assure that the program consumer will view what the program producer intended.
Video monitors are calibrated as often as on a daily basis in broadcast and production facilities. I'm not talking about only adjustments to the usual picture controls, but with instruments that set the gray scale properly, etc. These monitors are adjusted to industry standards, not the personal preference of the technician or the producer. It's the producer's artistic prerogotive to adjust set lighting, makeup, wardrobe, set design, etc. to acheive his prefered coloration to picture content. HE NEVER CHANGES THE MONITOR!
If you want to get as close as possible to experiencing the picture a program producer intended for you to see on your TV, it must be calibrated according to INDUSTRY STANDARDS. Your personal preference is only meaningful for you. The rest of the video consumer world was intended to see what the program producer saw on his calibrated monitor. Pardon the pun, but do you see the picture now?
Best regards and beautiful pictures,
Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
"Advancing the art and science of electronic imaging"
It appears you have never had a TV of yours professionally calibrated. If all the individual did to your TV (when you paid the $250.00) was to adjust the user controls, you were way over-charged! Did he not use a color analyzer or optical comparator to make adjustments in the set's service menu? You make it sound like he only used a test DVD and adjusted the consumer-level controls. That's not a professional gray scale calibration and not a legitimate representation of what the ISF teaches or stands for. It does not sound like you have ever had the opportunity to see what a reference video image can look like.
Concerning subjective picture preferences: you may think a great painting would look better with more pink in it. The artist would likely disagree. The Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers has labored long and hard to establish and promote standards and practices in the professional production community. They have done this to preserve accuracy and consistency all along the production chain. The goal is to assure that the program consumer will view what the program producer intended.
Video monitors are calibrated as often as on a daily basis in broadcast and production facilities. I'm not talking about only adjustments to the usual picture controls, but with instruments that set the gray scale properly, etc. These monitors are adjusted to industry standards, not the personal preference of the technician or the producer. It's the producer's artistic prerogotive to adjust set lighting, makeup, wardrobe, set design, etc. to acheive his prefered coloration to picture content. HE NEVER CHANGES THE MONITOR!
If you want to get as close as possible to experiencing the picture a program producer intended for you to see on your TV, it must be calibrated according to INDUSTRY STANDARDS. Your personal preference is only meaningful for you. The rest of the video consumer world was intended to see what the program producer saw on his calibrated monitor. Pardon the pun, but do you see the picture now?
Best regards and beautiful pictures,
Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
"Advancing the art and science of electronic imaging"
Alan Brown...As far as I'm concerned, I have calibrated my tv better than anyone in the world can calibrate it. Found this on the internet...
How to Calibrate Grayscale:
There are a number of ways to calibrate the grayscale of a TV. It can either be done by eye or by measuring the light from the TV with a color meter (Spectroradiometer or Tristimulus Colorimeter). Whatever the method, it will involve using the service menu and requires an understanding of how to navigate through a vast array of numbers and symbols along with knowledge on what parameters to change and which to leave alone.
When using Avia DVD, the process is relatively simple. You navigate through the menus of the DVD to select the correct grayscale window which range from 0-IRE (black) to 100-IRE (white). In a dark room, with minimum lighting and resulting reflections, you carefully go through each gray window from black to white, and use your eyes to see if the image appears to be gray or have color intrusion. The most common color intrusions seen are red in the darker images and blue push in the lighter images, but please remember this is NOT Red Push or Blue Push. Red Push is related to color and hue, not grayscale. While in each window (black to white), it may be easy to see colors bleed through. If colors are visible, you access the service menu and adjust the correct setting to reduce that color. In some cases, colors may need to be increased in order to make gray look gray.
How to Calibrate Grayscale:
There are a number of ways to calibrate the grayscale of a TV. It can either be done by eye or by measuring the light from the TV with a color meter (Spectroradiometer or Tristimulus Colorimeter). Whatever the method, it will involve using the service menu and requires an understanding of how to navigate through a vast array of numbers and symbols along with knowledge on what parameters to change and which to leave alone.
When using Avia DVD, the process is relatively simple. You navigate through the menus of the DVD to select the correct grayscale window which range from 0-IRE (black) to 100-IRE (white). In a dark room, with minimum lighting and resulting reflections, you carefully go through each gray window from black to white, and use your eyes to see if the image appears to be gray or have color intrusion. The most common color intrusions seen are red in the darker images and blue push in the lighter images, but please remember this is NOT Red Push or Blue Push. Red Push is related to color and hue, not grayscale. While in each window (black to white), it may be easy to see colors bleed through. If colors are visible, you access the service menu and adjust the correct setting to reduce that color. In some cases, colors may need to be increased in order to make gray look gray.
As a calibration instructor I am obviously in support of these services, but once again we need to recognize peoples differences. In our attempts to meet standards we try to conform as best possible. This means that we calibrate a setting that is correct for a correct viewing environment as to specification. But then when we leave, the customer may decide that they prefer to watch with some or more ambient light than was used during the calibration. Now they suddenly have a dark image in comparison to the relative lighting of the room. This was the leading complaint that I had in the early years of calibration, which led me to start doing day and night settings. The ISF recognizes this as a shortcoming of many current displays and has put the challenge to the industry to provide a day and night memory for every input on the TV.
For the record, an ISF calibration is far more than adjusting the user controls. As was stated, the grayscale must be done in the service menu. This is not subjective, there is a target to reach that does not vary according to time of day. Also, when available, the color decoder must also be set correctly. When it comes to the user controls, they are certainly not set and forget, they need to be accessible. The best thing you can get out of a professional calibration would be to learn how the calibrator adjusts these according to the current conditions, and reset them according to any changes in environment or image source. These front panel controls can also be the subjective ones, so you can fine tune these to your tastes if you prefer, but this still isn't affecting the grayscale much so it's not like the professional calibration is being altered out of spec. Some parts of a calibration are purely scientific and should not be fussed with, such as grayscale. But many other aspects are just as varied as the differences in how each one of us perceive color. That is why these controls are used for "fine tuning". I had a long discussion about this with a customer, only to find out after about two hours that they are slightly color blind, you don't want to know how their fine tuning came out.
For the record, an ISF calibration is far more than adjusting the user controls. As was stated, the grayscale must be done in the service menu. This is not subjective, there is a target to reach that does not vary according to time of day. Also, when available, the color decoder must also be set correctly. When it comes to the user controls, they are certainly not set and forget, they need to be accessible. The best thing you can get out of a professional calibration would be to learn how the calibrator adjusts these according to the current conditions, and reset them according to any changes in environment or image source. These front panel controls can also be the subjective ones, so you can fine tune these to your tastes if you prefer, but this still isn't affecting the grayscale much so it's not like the professional calibration is being altered out of spec. Some parts of a calibration are purely scientific and should not be fussed with, such as grayscale. But many other aspects are just as varied as the differences in how each one of us perceive color. That is why these controls are used for "fine tuning". I had a long discussion about this with a customer, only to find out after about two hours that they are slightly color blind, you don't want to know how their fine tuning came out.
Chukken,
It sounds like you have more familiarity with display calibration procedures than was discernable from your previous comments. However, precise gray scale is typically not recognizable without a true gray reference for comparison. You may be one of a rare minority with "perfect pitch" in this category. This usual difficulty is due to the adaptive nature of the human visual system. If the goal is accuracy, a gray reference must be used in a strictly "by eye" adjustment procedure, as a matter of standard method. To suggest to the average person that they can rely on their judgement for accuracy, without a true gray reference, is folly. Should "looks great to me" be sufficient for you, no gray reference is needed. Some of us don't trust our eyes and want to see what the program producer's eyes saw in post production. It's really all about the art, as Joe Kane is known to say.
There are many misconceptions among video consumers about display issues and calibration in particular. This is one of those forums we would like to serve as a reservoir of accurate information on these topics. Often, this requires open discussion, debate and some degree of confrontation. No one knows it all and sometimes statements can be misunderstood. We simply want the best pictures our HDTVs can deliver.
Best regards and beautiful pictures,
Alan Brown, President
CinemaQuest, Inc.
"Advancing the art and science of electronic imaging"
P.S. Seth made many vital points. Most impactful was the issue of ambient lighting. If the owner of a calibrated TV does not understand the dramatic effect that room lighting can have on display appearance, they can think a calibrated TV is too dark. Many TVs are calibrated for optimum viewing conditions. That means a dark viewing environment. If there has been no "day mode" setting provided in a memory for alternate viewing in bright conditions, the customer will have to adjust the picture controls to compensate.
2 Years ago I had a RPTV calibrated for $250.00 and to tell you the honest truth, I felt ripped off. After the tech left I set it according to my liking. So in essense, I threw away $250.00...I was under the impression that calibration was some highly skilled deal where the tech was going to go inside the tv and mess with a bunch of intricate settings inside the tv...If I had known that calibration was just a big word for setting your brightness, contrast, color, tint, and the like I would have saved my money and done that myself...(oh well, lesson learned)
The purpose of HD Library is to promote accuracy and references for HD audio and video. The value for readers and professionals is education about accuracy and references, the ability to ask questions about that and the ability to post their experiences for comment or to add to the documentation in the library sections. All of this means absolutely nothing, zip, nadda, if there are not professionals out in the field to assist you with this and would be worthless to a consumer.
Chuckken, you have been with us for over 9 months and this is the first time you have brought this to my attention. There is little to be done at this point being 2 years ago and I am very disappointed to hear such things.
Before contracting an unknown calibrator you should confirm that they are actually listed on the ISF website. Click on ISF-trained dealers with calibration equipment, select the state of the calibrator and you should find their company name listed in alphabetical order. If you cannot find your calibrator listed then please contact them and confirm they are really ISF. In some rare cases the person or company may not be listed due to market conditions or alliances in their area. Please feel free to send an email to the ISF for verification of their status.
[email protected]
Here at HD Library we have a listing of independent ISF calibrators who have built a reputation for delivering the real thing and are also members of the ISF Forum, a private professional community for the calibration industry. This is an excellent place to start if you are in the market for calibration service or product selection service.
If you are not happy with the ISF calibration service please contact the person or company who performed the service first. We are professionals willing and ready to explain the process, what was done to your display and assist you with understanding the results. We want you to be satisfied with the service!
If you should run into a problem with your calibration and are dissatisfied with the service you received please consider HD Library your ISF Customer Care Center and feel free to bring your situation or problem to my attention regardless of how you contracted this person or the forums or groups they work with. All I care about is the fact that you are dissatisfied with the service and the only requirement for my immediate attention is that they are listed on the ISF website with equipment or you have received confirmation from the ISF that they are in good standing and have equipment. ISF dealers without equipment should not be performing, representing or marketing the standard ISF calibration service unless they are working with an independent ISF calibrator who provides this service for them.
[email protected]
The purpose of HD Library is to promote accuracy and references for HD audio and video. The value for readers and professionals is education about accuracy and references, the ability to ask questions about that and the ability to post their experiences for comment or to add to the documentation in the library sections. All of this means absolutely nothing, zip, nadda, if there are not professionals out in the field to assist you with this and would be worthless to a consumer.
Chuckken, you have been with us for over 9 months and this is the first time you have brought this to my attention. There is little to be done at this point being 2 years ago and I am very disappointed to hear such things.
Before contracting an unknown calibrator you should confirm that they are actually listed on the ISF website. Click on ISF-trained dealers with calibration equipment, select the state of the calibrator and you should find their company name listed in alphabetical order. If you cannot find your calibrator listed then please contact them and confirm they are really ISF. In some rare cases the person or company may not be listed due to market conditions or alliances in their area. Please feel free to send an email to the ISF for verification of their status.
[email protected]
Here at HD Library we have a listing of independent ISF calibrators who have built a reputation for delivering the real thing and are also members of the ISF Forum, a private professional community for the calibration industry. This is an excellent place to start if you are in the market for calibration service or product selection service.
If you are not happy with the ISF calibration service please contact the person or company who performed the service first. We are professionals willing and ready to explain the process, what was done to your display and assist you with understanding the results. We want you to be satisfied with the service!
If you should run into a problem with your calibration and are dissatisfied with the service you received please consider HD Library your ISF Customer Care Center and feel free to bring your situation or problem to my attention regardless of how you contracted this person or the forums or groups they work with. All I care about is the fact that you are dissatisfied with the service and the only requirement for my immediate attention is that they are listed on the ISF website with equipment or you have received confirmation from the ISF that they are in good standing and have equipment. ISF dealers without equipment should not be performing, representing or marketing the standard ISF calibration service unless they are working with an independent ISF calibrator who provides this service for them.
[email protected]
My two cents worth: Get the full blown calibration done if you're going to do it at all. An example is a from the ground up convergence using a grid, which does get done with a full blown calibration. I can tell you that tweak alone will give you an incredible improvement in the picture quality, and make convergence adjustment on your RPTV a rare event.
One other comment on picture quality. I might be a bit off topic here, and this will probably sound like a cheap plug, but if any of you value your eyesight at all, look into bias lighting like you can get from Alan Brown's company. (His lamp gets two thumbs and two toes up from me!) If you're watching in a darkened room like I do, the reduction in eye fatigue is flat out amazing. Alan will tell you, and I agree, the colors look better too, but that reduction in eye fatigue makes this an easy tweak worth every penny.
Ken
One other comment on picture quality. I might be a bit off topic here, and this will probably sound like a cheap plug, but if any of you value your eyesight at all, look into bias lighting like you can get from Alan Brown's company. (His lamp gets two thumbs and two toes up from me!) If you're watching in a darkened room like I do, the reduction in eye fatigue is flat out amazing. Alan will tell you, and I agree, the colors look better too, but that reduction in eye fatigue makes this an easy tweak worth every penny.
Ken
An example is a from the ground up convergence using a grid
Ken, you likely have a Mits...?
Thanks,
Richard, yes, I have a Mits and love it. They really are capable of stunning HD picture quality when they're dialed in, which is probably true of most HD sets.
One other thought on calibration, and viewing an image we "like". One of the best pieces of advice I've received on this topic is to not make up your mind too quickly. Sometimes we don't like the picture initially after adjustment because it's different. A perfect example is color saturation which might seem washed out after calibration. But if you stick with it for a week or so and then switch back, you might be really surprised at what you see and what you like.
Ken
One other thought on calibration, and viewing an image we "like". One of the best pieces of advice I've received on this topic is to not make up your mind too quickly. Sometimes we don't like the picture initially after adjustment because it's different. A perfect example is color saturation which might seem washed out after calibration. But if you stick with it for a week or so and then switch back, you might be really surprised at what you see and what you like.
Ken
Great tips!
With color I have had the exact opposite experience with one client but he seems to have finally approved...
With color I have had the exact opposite experience with one client but he seems to have finally approved...
If I have an ISF calibration done wouldn't it be best to allow my eyes call the gray and other measurements while the tech does the calibration? Seems to me since I am the end user I would want things the way my novice eyes see them. Is that possible during a calibration or won't they do it thay way?
If I have an ISF calibration done wouldn't it be best to allow my eyes call the gray and other measurements while the tech does the calibration?
A comment on "gray".
The world of film photography and video production photography centers on a Standard "gray" card that all light meters are calibrated against. A lot of light meters are "average" type and expose to try to recreate this average gray over the frame. You can easily see this effect on pictures shot on snow or the beach where there is a lot of white-the snow comes out gray in your print!. Have too many white clouds in the scene and they come out gray, and the foreground too dark. The problem then is how to properly create a range of brightness between white and black to accurately represent the scenes range of black to white. Color brightness follows this same gray scale. Since the human eye has a wider brightness range than any film or video media or any print paper or TV screen it becomes a compromise which is part of the art of photography.
Turning to TV, the pros spend enormous effort and expense to set the brightness range of the pictures they produce to the proper range for display. It is actually possible to have "blacker than black" or "whiter than white", but if the video is produced outside the "standards" problems occur. There is a FCC requirement that video not be broadcast with bright sections "whiter" than the standard white as damage could occur in the user's display. My video editor has a tool to zebra stripe every white section in each video frame that is "not broadcast safe" for white, and then correct brightness. Many high end video cameras have the same zebra stripe option in the viewfinder to correct the problem at the beginning.
The objective of using proper standards in the User's display is to recreate as closely as possible this Industry standard range of black to white. When it is done you are seeing nearly the same picture the producer of the video intended you to see.
Just as you can't set proper exposure on a film camera by your eye, you can't set up a TV display without some reference standards. The normal user (me included) does not have the equipment or knowledge to do this right.
The eye can be fooled by a colored wall behind a TV display into thinking the display is "off color" and the same is true of room brightness. This is why a dark gray background behind the display is the ideal, but seldom achieved. My wife and I compromised on a very dark green for the wall behind our display matching the green of the decor. In daylight it is dark green, but when the room is dimmed the eye sees it as dark gray since the eye is not as sensitive to color in dim light.
A comment on "gray".
The world of film photography and video production photography centers on a Standard "gray" card that all light meters are calibrated against. A lot of light meters are "average" type and expose to try to recreate this average gray over the frame. You can easily see this effect on pictures shot on snow or the beach where there is a lot of white-the snow comes out gray in your print!. Have too many white clouds in the scene and they come out gray, and the foreground too dark. The problem then is how to properly create a range of brightness between white and black to accurately represent the scenes range of black to white. Color brightness follows this same gray scale. Since the human eye has a wider brightness range than any film or video media or any print paper or TV screen it becomes a compromise which is part of the art of photography.
Turning to TV, the pros spend enormous effort and expense to set the brightness range of the pictures they produce to the proper range for display. It is actually possible to have "blacker than black" or "whiter than white", but if the video is produced outside the "standards" problems occur. There is a FCC requirement that video not be broadcast with bright sections "whiter" than the standard white as damage could occur in the user's display. My video editor has a tool to zebra stripe every white section in each video frame that is "not broadcast safe" for white, and then correct brightness. Many high end video cameras have the same zebra stripe option in the viewfinder to correct the problem at the beginning.
The objective of using proper standards in the User's display is to recreate as closely as possible this Industry standard range of black to white. When it is done you are seeing nearly the same picture the producer of the video intended you to see.
Just as you can't set proper exposure on a film camera by your eye, you can't set up a TV display without some reference standards. The normal user (me included) does not have the equipment or knowledge to do this right.
The eye can be fooled by a colored wall behind a TV display into thinking the display is "off color" and the same is true of room brightness. This is why a dark gray background behind the display is the ideal, but seldom achieved. My wife and I compromised on a very dark green for the wall behind our display matching the green of the decor. In daylight it is dark green, but when the room is dimmed the eye sees it as dark gray since the eye is not as sensitive to color in dim light.
DonShan,
Thanks! I have a new Sony LCD - KDF55WF655 on its way. I have the DVE-DVD. Two questions. How long of a breakin period before I tune with DVE. How long after should I wait to have an ISF calibration done?
Mike
Thanks! I have a new Sony LCD - KDF55WF655 on its way. I have the DVE-DVD. Two questions. How long of a breakin period before I tune with DVE. How long after should I wait to have an ISF calibration done?
Mike
Break in: Preparing the display for calibration
http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3796
http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3796
THANKS!
Hi,
The following suggestion is not meant to insult anyone but I bring it up because of an experience with my own father and his pride.
No one can appreciate the beauty that this world has too offer if they don't see properly. Your vision may very well seem to be fine at HighNoon in a well lit area. I haven't been to a movie theatre in a while but I remember that the last time I was there I noticed many people putting on glasses because thir eyes didn't operate as well in a darkeded room or a dark Highway when driving at night as they used to.
I don't need glasses except to read under normal well lit circumstances but I find my eyes get tired very quickly if I have to drive much more than an hour at night so I don't.
Particularly if you've reached a certain age, please have your eyes checked regularly, (whether you think you need it or not) and tell the eye doctor that you have a Home Theatre and will be watching alot of stuff in a relatively if not totally darkened room.
If your going to have your set professionally calibrated make sure you can appreciate visually the work thats been done.
Peter m.
The following suggestion is not meant to insult anyone but I bring it up because of an experience with my own father and his pride.
No one can appreciate the beauty that this world has too offer if they don't see properly. Your vision may very well seem to be fine at HighNoon in a well lit area. I haven't been to a movie theatre in a while but I remember that the last time I was there I noticed many people putting on glasses because thir eyes didn't operate as well in a darkeded room or a dark Highway when driving at night as they used to.
I don't need glasses except to read under normal well lit circumstances but I find my eyes get tired very quickly if I have to drive much more than an hour at night so I don't.
Particularly if you've reached a certain age, please have your eyes checked regularly, (whether you think you need it or not) and tell the eye doctor that you have a Home Theatre and will be watching alot of stuff in a relatively if not totally darkened room.
If your going to have your set professionally calibrated make sure you can appreciate visually the work thats been done.
Peter m.
To me, real calibration comes down to whatever makes the viewer/owner happy, 
Hi,
I totally agree about what makes you happy. The only problem with that is, it could be alot of work.
My brother and I have approximately the same tv. Both rptv Tosh (his slightly smaller). I spoke to him a couple of years ago about having a full calibration and having just bought the set, he didn't want or feel the need to spend the money and has long since forgotten about that conversation.
It did however come up a few weeks ago when he took the plunge and got a HDTV decoder from our cable provider.
Since we spend alot of time at each others place, (mine more than his), he asked me quite innocently why whenever he was watching my tv and changed the channels, he never had the urge to play with the brightness and contrast and on his set he finds himself doing that constantly.
I reminded him about the ISF calibration conversation, (particularly for crt based rptv's). He said yeah maybe, but I really don't think its a priority and I don't think he'll have it done. Its his tv, if he's happy thats all that matters.
Peter m.
I totally agree about what makes you happy. The only problem with that is, it could be alot of work.
My brother and I have approximately the same tv. Both rptv Tosh (his slightly smaller). I spoke to him a couple of years ago about having a full calibration and having just bought the set, he didn't want or feel the need to spend the money and has long since forgotten about that conversation.
It did however come up a few weeks ago when he took the plunge and got a HDTV decoder from our cable provider.
Since we spend alot of time at each others place, (mine more than his), he asked me quite innocently why whenever he was watching my tv and changed the channels, he never had the urge to play with the brightness and contrast and on his set he finds himself doing that constantly.
I reminded him about the ISF calibration conversation, (particularly for crt based rptv's). He said yeah maybe, but I really don't think its a priority and I don't think he'll have it done. Its his tv, if he's happy thats all that matters.
Peter m.
I just got a older (almost 6 Yrs) Toshiba RPTV calibrated by an ISF calibrater. Details are posted in the "Video Calibration-feedback thread". I had a problem of setting black levels correctly using the user controls due to dirt and aging issues , that was corrected by cleaning the mirror and optics and internal recalibration of the gray scale. I got even more. A "good" monitor became "great"!. It took special instruments and a computer to do it right. My calibration took most of a day to do by an expert( plus a VERY long day for his travel time), because the settings and several convergence setups were checked and done over until everything was RIGHT on. One of the differences between the ISF guy's eyes and mine, is he has seen lots of sets and knows "what is possible and which hex code to enter into the service setup to get it right"
A monitor I feared was wearing out has been reborn!.
A monitor I feared was wearing out has been reborn!.
Hi Don,
Your post makes me think of those old "FRAM" oil filter ads where a mechanic servicing a neglected car says, "You can pay me now, or pay me later".
People are just starting to wrap their minds around the concept of HDTV and the equipment that will bring it to them. There is so much misinformation out there its freithening.
I was at Best Buy the other day talking to a saleman about something and happened to mention that I"m constantly using my 65" Tosh as a computer monitor at 856 x 480 and the salesman told me that their taught that if a prospect asks them about that on a crt based tv their to tell them that it could cause burnin. I suggested that he keep telling them that because the only thing that will make it safe is the lowering of the brightness and contrast done during an ISF calibration. I also said I'd been doing it for 4yrs without burnin issues.
Anyway I don't let it frustrate me anymore. I used to be evangelical about it but when you see folks eyes glaze over in that "Your boring me look" you stop wasting your time.
Peter m.
Your post makes me think of those old "FRAM" oil filter ads where a mechanic servicing a neglected car says, "You can pay me now, or pay me later".
People are just starting to wrap their minds around the concept of HDTV and the equipment that will bring it to them. There is so much misinformation out there its freithening.
I was at Best Buy the other day talking to a saleman about something and happened to mention that I"m constantly using my 65" Tosh as a computer monitor at 856 x 480 and the salesman told me that their taught that if a prospect asks them about that on a crt based tv their to tell them that it could cause burnin. I suggested that he keep telling them that because the only thing that will make it safe is the lowering of the brightness and contrast done during an ISF calibration. I also said I'd been doing it for 4yrs without burnin issues.
Anyway I don't let it frustrate me anymore. I used to be evangelical about it but when you see folks eyes glaze over in that "Your boring me look" you stop wasting your time.
Peter m.
Hi Don,
Your post makes me think of those old "FRAM" oil filter ads where a mechanic servicing a neglected car says, "You can pay me now, or pay me later".
Peter m.
In my case not getting the 1999 unit calibrated earlier was not the usual excuses of "not knowing" or "the money". I expected HDTV progams to be here by 2002 and was going to get "calibrated" as soon as I had a HD signal. I finally got DirecTV HD in 2003, but by then I found there no local tech I would trust. It was this forum that found me an ISF person I would trust to do the job who would do the 400 mile roundtrip. Again the power of information exchange on the net.
Your post makes me think of those old "FRAM" oil filter ads where a mechanic servicing a neglected car says, "You can pay me now, or pay me later".
Peter m.
In my case not getting the 1999 unit calibrated earlier was not the usual excuses of "not knowing" or "the money". I expected HDTV progams to be here by 2002 and was going to get "calibrated" as soon as I had a HD signal. I finally got DirecTV HD in 2003, but by then I found there no local tech I would trust. It was this forum that found me an ISF person I would trust to do the job who would do the 400 mile roundtrip. Again the power of information exchange on the net.
Donshan,
Ha! I'm debating having Richard over to "revive" a 1994 RCA 52". Your 1999 model is but a whipper-snapper!
Re: the original post, Chuckken, you should know by now that the ISF cal is going to address things that you should NOT be foolin' with:
1) Overscan. Made a world of dif on my 53" Pioneer.
2) Grid convergence with a template. Richard did a partial for a partial fee. I should've coughed up enough for the full grid routine... there is still a slight stretch on one small portion of the screen, but I know it's there, and it bugs me. BTW, I haven't had to adjust the user convergence, not even once, not even a little bit, and it's been over a year.
3) Greyscale. 2+2 always = 4. Grey always = grey. It's not up to you to decide what the essence of grey is, and the only way to tell if your set is accurate is with a meter. Stop whining about it.
4) Color accuracy. See item #3.
5) Contrast, brightness, and sharpness. Until you've seen it done with a gool old oscilloscope, you just don't know what you're missing.
Sorry for the tone, Richard, but misleading posts drive me nuts.
Ha! I'm debating having Richard over to "revive" a 1994 RCA 52". Your 1999 model is but a whipper-snapper!
Re: the original post, Chuckken, you should know by now that the ISF cal is going to address things that you should NOT be foolin' with:
1) Overscan. Made a world of dif on my 53" Pioneer.
2) Grid convergence with a template. Richard did a partial for a partial fee. I should've coughed up enough for the full grid routine... there is still a slight stretch on one small portion of the screen, but I know it's there, and it bugs me. BTW, I haven't had to adjust the user convergence, not even once, not even a little bit, and it's been over a year.
3) Greyscale. 2+2 always = 4. Grey always = grey. It's not up to you to decide what the essence of grey is, and the only way to tell if your set is accurate is with a meter. Stop whining about it.
4) Color accuracy. See item #3.
5) Contrast, brightness, and sharpness. Until you've seen it done with a gool old oscilloscope, you just don't know what you're missing.
Sorry for the tone, Richard, but misleading posts drive me nuts.
Grumpy,
Long time no post...
Hmm... That is a casual veiwing display. I would recommend a tune up rather than calibration. If you can hold out a year I can do that when we tune up the Pioneer. Call me...
We can catch that in another year for the maintenance.
How did you like the Waveform Review on the Zenith?
Good hearing from ya
Long time no post...
I'm debating having Richard over to "revive" a 1994 RCA 52"
Hmm... That is a casual veiwing display. I would recommend a tune up rather than calibration. If you can hold out a year I can do that when we tune up the Pioneer. Call me...
I should've coughed up enough for the full grid routine...
We can catch that in another year for the maintenance.
Until you've seen it done with a gool old oscilloscope, you just don't know what you're missing.
How did you like the Waveform Review on the Zenith?
Good hearing from ya
Richard,
Yeah, I know, it's been a while... I suppose I've been too busy watching all the HD that is finally available! The Zenith review was about what I expected: The RP82 was a rare gift, and every "Deal of the Century" since has been a disappointment in the accuracy arena.
Fortunately, my system is calibrated, my reception is great (and free), my recliner is comfy... I really don't need to do anything but enjoy it all.
Yeah, I know, it's been a while... I suppose I've been too busy watching all the HD that is finally available! The Zenith review was about what I expected: The RP82 was a rare gift, and every "Deal of the Century" since has been a disappointment in the accuracy arena.
Fortunately, my system is calibrated, my reception is great (and free), my recliner is comfy... I really don't need to do anything but enjoy it all.